A broadcaster for more than 35 years, Anne Cassin's media home for the last 13 years has been on Nationwide. Now with her children grown up, she chats to Janice Butler about the eternal quandary of work-home balance, entering a new stage of life, and her plans beyond Nationwide.
"It’s a bit embarrassing when you realise you are the archive," laughs Anne Cassin when we meet in the famous RTÉ canteen to chat. She’s commenting on the fact that she’s entering her 13th year on Nationwide, having joined then co-host Mary Kennedy when Michael Ryan retired in 2011. Mary Kennedy in turn retired in 2019 and Anne was joined by Bláthnaid Ní Chofaigh.
"There’s only one way to look at it and that’s positively and to be grateful that we’re still there," says Anne of the show in her typically matter-of-fact way.
When I meet Anne, she’s busy in the editing suite, putting together items for the show. She says that while she is usually on the road, crisscrossing the entire country, the last month has mainly been spent in Leinster, keeping the further afield filming for brighter days.
"It’s just the way it falls with the evenings getting dark so early. We keep those nice Wild Atlantic Way shots for the summertime when it’s bright and you can film for much longer. It’s just the way it’s evolved over the years."
When you meet Anne, there’ a feeling of knowing her better than you actually do, which she explains simply: "That’s what happens when you’ve been on people’s screens for so long." She is both warm and direct in equal measure. She also remains curious about the lives and experiences of the people she meets on her many trips on the highways and byways.
Unlike many in the industry, she has no worries about "traditional" television dying out any time soon, pointing to the viewing figures for Nationwide as testimony to the number of people who still tune into scheduled TV.
"They’ve been off the scale lately, really strong. We got a 45% share of audience there a couple of weeks ago, at the end of January, for a regular Nationwide programme that was about the Liberties in Dublin. There’s no telling what will pique people’s interest, but the audience seem to like what we’re doing. Legacy broadcasting and traditional media is pretty resilient, and I think we write it off too easily," she remarks.
In her 13 years on the show, Anne says the instances of being recognised in Dublin have increased; something that in the past was more common outside the capital.
"I get people stopping me several times a week and I could over think this but it’s probably because I’ve been there quite a long time. It’s really gratifying because it means we’re connecting and engaging. People normally have lovely things to say – we’re Irish after all, so we do the back-biting behind our backs!" she laughs.
Anne describes herself as a "people person". She dabbled with the idea of being an actor when she was younger (her father Barry was a celebrated stage and screen actor). "I thought about it for a second," she laughs. Instead, Anne, who grew up in rural Balbriggan, Co Dublin with four siblings, decided a career in broadcasting was for her. She cut her teeth working with Radio Nova before joining RTÉ in 1988, where she worked in various departments, from news to sport. Before Nationwide, she presented Capital D, a sort of 'Dublin-wide’ with stories from inside the Pale.
While you wouldn’t think it now, Anne says she was incredibly shy when she was younger; obviously something she had to work on in her chosen profession. "Without getting too deep, I was very shy as a youngster, cripplingly so. Along the way, I got a bit more confidence, but sure, that all comes with age," she adds. "My mum was a great talker, my siblings love to yack, too much maybe, so I think it’s very much part of who I am. I think what I’ve got better at, because I’ve had to work at it, is being a better listener than I used to be. That takes intention and I would have worked at that."
Did she have to knock on lots of doors to get the opportunities she did? "I was lucky. I got a couple of breaks at the right time. I always wanted to work in broadcasting and was very clear about that. I came into RTÉ as a continuity announcer and had several jobs along the way. I’ve been here a long time, some might say institutionalised, but I’d like to think not. A lot of it is luck and getting a couple of breaks."
Anne met her husband, Donagh McGrath, while working in the RTÉ newsroom. When she looks back at particular points in her career, when her three children (Ellen, Joe and Heather) were younger, she says that managing a career in television, especially one that had her on the road a lot, was a struggle.
"I was torn a lot of the time," she says. "You’d be getting into the car to go to West Cork and you don’t see them from one end of the day to the next. Working mother’s guilt; what’s new? We all have it and it’s real, it’s actually real. I was torn for a long time, and I blamed myself a lot," she adds.
"But the job was great; they’ve a great dad and I was well supported in terms of childcare. We had au pairs in the house for 12 years. When Heather was a week old, we had a French girl who came, and I was bringing her around Dublin showing her the sights with a tiny baby. We had people in the house until Heather finished primary school, and some of them I’m still in touch with. We spent all our money on childcare, trying to make it work," she recalls, "but I’m really in support of working women and I would have empathy for all the issues with childcare. We weren’t in a position where we had family around and that was the fact of it," she adds.
Anne says it’s bittersweet that her three children are all grown up now and independent: Ellen (26) is just back home after three years in Edinburgh; Joe (24) has just flown the nest; and Heather, who is almost 20, will be heading away on Erasmus. "That takes you by surprise in a way that you don’t expect," she says. "Each phase has different aspect to it. It’s a different dynamic when they’re young adults, you have to try not to be such a Mammy," she laughs.
"It goes by so quickly, that’s the bit you can’t fathom. It all feels like just yesterday. It’s a different phase now, there’s boyfriends and girlfriends, and that’s nice, much more grown up."
A fully realised woman, then, happy in her skin, but that doesn’t mean she ignores the superficial aspects of the media world she moves in. Does being on screen bring an added pressure to always look the part? "I think the challenge is to embrace life at all its stages with positivity and to age gracefully, if that doesn’t sound too naive," she replies.
"Pressure isn’t the word I’d use, but you feel there’s an expectation to present well, that’s the way I’d look at it. Does that mean I’m too scared to go out in my tracksuit bottoms and no make-up on? No, I’m not, but I don’t do that too often. I have been known to drop my daughter to the Luas in my dressing gown; one of these days I’ll be caught," she laughs.
Anne is coy on the question of retirement; having seen her friend and colleague Mary Kennedy depart RTÉ in 2019, how does she feel about that next stage and life after Nationwide?
"Sometimes I think, yes, I can’t wait," she replies, "and other days I don’t and that really is a day-to-day thing with me. I love meeting people and the stimulation it gives me. So sometimes, I think I wouldn’t want that to end and then other days, I think I’m too tired and just want to lay in the sun and learn French," she laughs.
"My peers are retiring and members of my own family too, but I suppose I still have this fear of ‘What am I going to do?’ The priority for me and Donagh would be to see the world a bit more. We’ve gone to some interesting places: we’ve been to Nepal and we went to Jordan last year, but I’d like to have the energy and curiosity to go a bit braver with our travels. But there’s no guarantees in life, so you just have to be really mindful about your health and taking care of yourself. I’m not giving you a straight answer; that’s how I am in life – ‘on the one hand, on the other’. I’m an awful ruminator and procrastinator," she admits.
Anne is a long-time runner, even if she now limits her outings to once a week, 5km park runs that she admits are "mostly tied into a meet-up with my female friends. We meet every Saturday and that run is as much about the coffee and chats afterwards as it is about the run. It’s for mental, social and physical health, so it’s ticking all those boxes for me."
Are there any work boxes she’s yet to tick; perhaps jumping on the podcast wagon?
"I listen to podcasts. Do I want to make them? No," she laughs. "It’s like people ask me do I want to write a book: no, I like to read. I’ve enough to be doing.
"There’s a few stories I’d like to do for Nationwide. I’d like to do something on Balbriggan, my hometown, that’s on my list. And I’d like to do more West of Ireland stuff.
Before she heads back to the editing studio, and since we’ve been in a reflective mood throughout our chat, I ask Anne about the current Insragram trend of ‘What would you tell your younger self if you met them for a coffee?’
"Don’t worry so much Anne, it will be fine and enjoy," she says, repeating the line again."I spent far too much time worrying and it all ends up fine."
