As Brian Dowling and Arthur Gourounlian announce the arrival of baby number two this summer, the couple chat to Janice Butler about expanding their family, dealing with the haters and how much their lives have changed since becoming parents to "sassy" baby Blake.
I met Arthur Gourounlian and Brian Dowling on the recent surprise snow day. I texted Arthur that morning to make sure he was still OK to travel into the city from their home in Co Kildare, but he tells me that he's already in situ in the spot we’d chosen. Brian is on the airwaves on his daily 98FM radio slot; the show must go on, a bit snowfall that typically brings Dublin to a standstill, isn’t stopping these two.
I chatted with choreographer and Dancing With the Stars judge, Arthur for about half an hour while we waited for Brian to join us fresh off his show with Suzanne Kane. I tell Arthur, who was charged with co-ordinating our interview, that he’s quite possibly the most positive person I’ve ever encountered; a breath of fresh air.
Wearing his trademark patterned wool jumper, silver rings and pushing his incredible hair off his face, he beams in response.
"I’m always happy. I’m high on life. The experiences I’ve had have given me that perspective; I really appreciate everything I have," he says. He is referring to his early years, during which he and his family fled Armenia to become refugees in Europe.
Brian comes bounding over to us, "I hope you weren’t waiting long," he smiles, offering a friendly handshake. He orders tea, as he sits down to spill some more tea: "Have you heard our news?" he says with a whisper and smile. The news is the arrival of the couple’s second child, due this summer; a sibling for their little girl, Blake.
Brian’s younger sister Aoife, who was the couple’s surrogate for baby Blake, is giving them this great gift again and is now at 24 weeks and all is going well with the pregnancy, with the baby due in June.
"Everything has gone so beautifully; baby is looking perfect, Aoife hasn’t been sick at all, but she’s very tired," says Brian.
"Arthur would have ten children, but I’m very content to leave it at two", laughs Brian of their expanding family.
"I really wanted her to have a sibling," adds Arthur. "I’ve a sister who is like my best friend and Brian has six sisters, so we know the importance of having siblings. Blake is so sassy, being an only child wouldn’t suit her," he laughs.
They know the baby’s sex but are keeping it to themselves. "We did the same with Blake. It will be a surprise," says Brian.
Brian and Arthur’s journey to parenthood was not a smooth one, which they documented in the TV show, A Very Modern Family, and best-selling book of the same name. The couple, who moved to Brian’s native Kildare from L.A during the pandemic, had tried the adoption route but kept coming up against obstacles and as a same sex couple they were not allowed to use surrogacy services in many countries.
A conversation one day with Brian’s sister Aoife, which they both say started as a joke, turned into a reality when she offered to be their surrogate.
"When we did the documentary, at the end they asked her would she do it again and she said 'Ya, why not? We’ll see what happens’ and I was so happy to hear that," says Arthur of Aoife’s involvement.
"We’re in such a lucky position where Aoife is willing to do this. She’s a young healthy woman, she’s my sister, she lives in the country and we were able to get a donor again. We’re just very, very lucky. It’s priceless to us, we’re really pinching ourselves," says Brian.
One thing the couple didn’t expect when they had Blake in September 2022 was the negativity and abusive comments they received on social media for becoming parents as a gay couple.
"I was so excited when we found out about Blake that I wanted to share the news with everyone but we got so much abuse that I’m nervous now that is going to happen again with this baby," says Brian.
"Even with Aoife, we’re so conscious to protect her, so we haven’t had her on our social media as much. I’m mindful of her, as her brother, but she’s the most incredibly strong person I know, she’s amazing," he adds.
As we’re on the topic, Arthur shows me a screengrab of a homophobic comment he received earlier that day. It shocks me, but Arthur says "We get it all the time, so much abuse because we’re two gay guys having kids," says Arthur. "We’re almost immune to it," he adds.
"There’s probably nothing now that people could say to me online about my looks, my weight, the way I talk, my family, what we have or don’t have, that I haven’t heard before," adds Brian. "97% of what we get is positive and so kind but that 3% can be crippling. It would almost take your breath away how horrible people can be, but you can’t focus on the hater," he adds: "The number of people who have reached out to us who have been inspired by our story, has been amazing."
When Blake was born, the couple chose not to share which one of them was her biological father. Since then, Brian has shared his struggles with infertility and the emotional distress that caused. Addressing his followers in a heartfelt video on Instagram last year, the presenter opened up about how Arthur’s sample was chosen because it was unlikely that they would conceive with his. It was something he struggled with for a long time and is still processing.
"I was mindful of my infertility going into the process with Blake. When she was born, it was almost like my ego needed the connection with her, where I was her favourite. I totally over-thought it and I was very honest about that. For me, I was embarrassed and ashamed so I overthought how I was going to attach myself to her. So when she was a baby, the fact I was able to soothe her was so reassuring to me. I love her so much and I’ve realised now it’s not about DNA but your head does go there," he says honestly.
"She’s definitely a Dowling," laughs Arthur. "That has nothing to do with me!"
How does Brian feel now about his infertility issues as they get ready to welcome baby number two?
"It’s a work in progress. Doing the book was so therapeutic because I’d never spoken about it before. Everyone has troubles and it’s just something I’ve had to work through. I wasn’t as embarrassed this time around.
"At this stage, it’s the lack of rights to me as her father that is the real problem and that still hasn’t been addressed in this country," he adds, a problem that many parents who have gone through surrogacy face; where they currently have no legally recognised relationship with their child.
"My name is still not on her birth certificate. People say ‘Why don’t you adopt her?’ but that shouldn’t be the only option. She’s my daughter. It’s like with my sister Aoife: she doesn’t want her name on Blake’s birth certificate either, she doesn’t want to be her legal anything. She wants to be her aunt and that’s great. People are so fearful of what we’re trying to do, but all we want is that people who have children through surrogacy are recognised as the parents. It’s Blake’s legal document so it should reflect her," Brian concludes passionately.
Are they worried about how much busier life is going to get with two under two this summer?
"I love things being a bit hectic," says Arthur, "I love the house to be busy. I’m used to Brian and his six sisters," he laughs. "They’re like a football team there’s so many, you can’t get a word in with them."
"We’ll be having three conversations at one time," laughs Brian, who is the eldest of the seven siblings.
He acknowledges the wisdom his mother Rosie, who died suddenly six years ago, passed onto him when he was younger.
"I believe Mum has very much helped us. I know that sounds odd, but I really feel her presence during this experience and with having Blake. She passed on so much to all of us, especially how to treat people with kindness."
Life pre-children was a very different picture for Arthur and Brian; the couple who met in London, were living it up at parties and glamorous events. Brian, a busy TV presenter and personality who won Big Brother in 2001 (and the Ultimate Big Brother in 2010) and Arthur, originally from Armenia, a successful choreographer and creative director who worked with the likes of Girls Aloud and Beyoncé.
"We did so much in our lives before having Blake, we travelled the world, we’ve done all the partying, but we’re happy to be at home with our family and building our lives. We’re not looking for a mid-life crisis," says Arthur.
"Your hair is your mid-life crisis!" laughs Brian.
Brian is now balancing radio and TV; he recently became co-host of The Six O’Clock Show on Virgin Media with Katja Mia. While he says it can be hard juggling work and home life, he’s happy to be in demand.
"I’m 46 this year, with almost two kids. I never thought I would be on a radio show every day and then later that evening on a TV show; it’s very rare you can say you’re doing both. We’re making it work, there’s definitely days I feel like the worst parent, but I work with really supportive people."
"I said to him, you have to take everything that comes along, you’re not getting any younger," laughs Arthur. "You never know what will happen in the industry; one minute you’re hot, the next you’re gone. With Brian and I, it’s all about teamwork; we say yes to everything and then we work it out."
Arthur has been on our screens for the last few months on Dancing With the Stars; he replaced former judge Julian Benson in 2022 and has been embraced by Irish audiences with his unique style and up-beat personality.
"I absolutely love being a judge on it. This is my third season, I can’t believe it. I wanted to do the best I could when I started and just be myself. They seemed happy with that; I was allowed keep the hair and rings," he laughs.
They are married for nine years this year and thinking of renewing their vows next year for the tenth anniversary. "There are people in our lives now who weren’t there when we first got married; the kids of course, so it would be lovely to celebrate the amazing things that have happened to us in the last ten years," says Brian.
"We’re definitely not spending what we spent the first time," laughs Arthur.
"We can’t now; a house and two kids," agrees Brian.
With that, we’re all back out in the snow, Brian on to his next job on the telly and Arthur is heading home to pick up Blake from her auntie’s. It’s normal life and they wouldn’t have it any other way. Later that day, I get another joyful text from Arthur, thanking me for spending time with them, despite the bad weather. And all I can think is, what lucky children, to call them both Dad.
