The following is reader reaction to this article on the issues in Irish rugby and the Autumn international series.
Within your first four paragraphs you refer to Brian O Driscoll as the best the game has ever seen. He has not performed to this standard in a long time,we are back to picking players because of a little history. Stop living in the past. We have up and coming players, Munster Vs New Zealand proved that. There is a rift in the Irish camp and it is becoming more and more obvious. There will be a complete different attitude from Kidney in the 6 Nations
Eoin, Limerick
REPLY (Brendan Cole): I said ‘one of the best’. Which he is.
------------------------------------
I blame the people at the games who aren’t real rugby supporters but who are there for the day out in the big city. Even if it’s not going right on the pitch people need to keep shouting and screaming support till there blue in the face. It’s easy to sit back and say “what are they doing!” but what are we doing about it. How can the players have passion if the majority of 80,000 people that surround them don’t? What good is home advantage if no one is cheering for the home side.
Rob, Limerick
REPLY: The main problem with Croke Park is the distance between the pitch and the crowd. In my opinion, this disengages a lot of people. It is also the case that a lot of people at Croke Park are sitting in a ‘corporate culture’ which is, I think, likely to result in their being quieter and less involved.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I would agree with Brendan to a large extent. I was one of the people at all three Autumn internationals, and the Munster v All Blacks match. The difference in atmosphere, sheer excitement, pride, and noise levels was massive. It was like two different planets. I also really believe that we have the wrong captain on the field. Brian is probably the best center we have ever had, but he is not a leader. I don’t see the same fight in Leinster players as the Munster players.
Phil, Limerick
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No doubt Ireland are playing very poor rugby at the moment, but when did they ever play really good rugby? I can only remember on two occasions Ireland playing well. They came very close to beating Australia in the 2003 world cup, but they lost. They beat England at Croke Park in 2007, but now look at England. That victory, although it was a great night for supporters, looks a bit hollow now. Basically they beat South Africa and Australia in meaningless games in Novemeber 2006 and that’s it!
Robert Scott, Dublin
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I think you have a cheek in what you said about Croke Park. If you don’t like the seating go back to you own 80,000 stadium. Oh wait you don’t have one. In fact you don’t even have a stadium! And if the IRFU want to charge E80 a ticket for “huge swathes” of seating then take it up with them. The GAA get along fine charging half that amount for big games. It’s typical rugby supporter ignorance that you have been allowed to play in the biggest and best stadium this country has ever seen and complain.
Paul Bridges, Dublin
REPLY The pitch is too far away. Also, from talking to the people who go to the games, a good deal seem to think that the view is of poor quality. The prices are another matter again - the GAA’s pricing system certainly seems more geared towards the average supporter.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ireland needs a sport’s shrink. There clearly is a lack of team cohesiveness. The three respective groups of provincial players “want” to bond, but they just don’t. Maybe the Leinster lads are a little envious of the Munster vibe. Maybe it’s the anthem thing with the Ulster boys. Maybe some of the Munster lads are a bit holier than thou. I really don’t know. I’m speculating. But whatever it is, it needs fixing. We have the talent, so let’s get the spirit back.
RedMtl, Canada
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Excellent piece; the truth rings out clear as a bell. Time we faced facts, about ourselves as a nation and what we have and have lost; and especially good to demythologise Croke Park. I was there for the All Blacks game and in Thomond three nights later, and it was like stepping thru a time portal. Munster retain the ethos of community, putting it on the line for people and place. At stages there were bodies all over the field such was the intensity. This is missing from the national side
Matt McG, UK
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
While there is something wrong with Irish rugby I’m not convinced that its as terminal as some people in the press make it out to be and I believe that given time the current system will work in fact I don’t believe we’ll really see the best out of the Ireland team until the end of the 2010 six nations. I’m pretty positive that we’ll be competitive for the next six nations but time will be needed to replace old systems with newer ones.
Samuel, Cork
REPLY I didn’t really get this across in the article, but I actually think Declan Kidney is the right man for the job and that he has an excellent chance of getting Ireland playing well again, soon.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Irish rugby made a big mistake letting Warren Gatland go - or should I say getting rid of him - look at what he’s done since and the way he had Wales playing in his first season. Need i go on
Jimmy McQuade, Cavan
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have not attended at Croke Park for Rugby, I prefer to follow Munster nearer home. As any part of that ground seems to do the business for Gaelic, I wonder if you could enlarge on the reasons for “huge swathes of the seating........totally unacceptable”.
Where these “swathes” are might also prove useful information for later. I’m not looking for a stick with which to beat anyone, just information!
Thomas Johnson, Tralee
REPLY I'm talking about the seating high up in the corners, at the Canal end, around the edge of the Hill, in the Davin stand, and in the seats that look out across at dead space at the end of each stand to name but a few. If the ball is in the right half, these seats are OK but when the ball is down the far end, they are very poor. Add in the big screens - replays are only selectively played if at all, and there are ads instead of highlights at half time – and the spectator experience leaves a lot to be desired. By and large, the match almost never gets ‘near’ the crowd.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In my opinion, the best player on the pitch against Argentina was actually Geordan Murphy and not Ronan O’Gara. Is it just a coincidence that he is based in the UK, away from the two “Super Clubs” that we have here in Ireland? Or is there a deep rooted problem or rift between the Munster and Leinster players which inhibits there ability to perform? When we watch Ireland play, we don’t see a cohesive team of talented individuals, which is what they are on paper. We see a group of guys struggling to play with confidence. Whether that has more to do with individual players not having confidence in their team-mates we’ll never know. I think Declan Kidney’s biggest task is going to be to try and resolve the lack of confidence and passion which prevails throughout the team. And when he’s finished doing that he better start looking for a new out half because Ronan can’t kick Ireland out of jail for much longer.
Banker On The Edge, Dublin
REPLY Can’t agree on Ronan O’Gara and am actually one of the few who felt he deserved man of the match against Argentina. Argentina needed to be stood up to and, aside from generating most of Ireland’s points, O’Gara led the effort in that respect.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fantastic article. Having been away on a year out, the game on Saturday was my first time being at an Irish International in a while. A Euro a minute for a game like that is just wrong. I mean if Argentina had played well and we had got a result like that I would have walked away happy, but they were appalling. If the Irish back line had strung a decent move together the winning margin would have been huge. Someone needs to tell Marcus Horan he is not a utility back.
John, Dublin
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Its about time people stopped jumping on the band wagon. It happened when Ireland were a few points away from winning a 6 Nations and happening now when they are a few games away from getting things on track. Nonsensical argument almost what you’d expect to hear in a pub. No passion blah blah blah. New coach, new systems, Kidney can’t be expected to produce a top team after a month. People who think so should read less tabloids.
Simon, Wicklow
REPLY I think Declan Kidney will end up doing a very good job.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Eddie O’Sullivan put his team through such an intense weights regime that they became leaden footed body builders rather than athletes. Our running game suffered hugely but in time I believe we will find our old speed coming back and with it our confidence. Kidney, given time, will do a great job and already we can see signs of improvement in defense and forward momentum as well as squad selection. Irish rugby will rise again!
Eamonn Hoban, Naas
REPLY I think Ireland’s training was in hindsight badly thought out. No fun basically. I sometimes suspect that they almost started to fall into a trap of thinking that the more they sacrificed – freezing in Poland and the likes – the more they would deserve to win.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
To George Hook - If more of the team had as much pride and passion as Ronan O’Gara we would have a much better team to day. Pride and passion we do very well in Munster.
Tom, Manchester
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The analysis is correct but everyone knows that already. All this talk of belief and ‘founding myth’ is patriotic and heart warming but I’m sure there isn’t a single Irish international from Munster/Leinster or any club/province who forgets this as soon as they put on a green jersey. Starting point, Rob Kearney at full back to get a spark to ignite something.
Ronan Holmes, Dublin
REPLY I don’t think any Irish players are unpatriotic. However, I’m not sure if the team use their emotions as effectively as once was the case.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
For two years I’ve been reading Brendan Cole’s articles - through the good and the bad - and he consistently nails it. My two cents? O’Gara hasn’t looked happy in an Irish shirt for a long time. O’Driscoll had two great games this season...when he wasn't captaining Leinster! Why make him captain of Ireland again? It is so obvious I can’t believe no one else is saying it. The lineout has not been the force it was....remember the England game in Croker? Now that was a functioning Irish lineout.
Colm, Dublin
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I think you might have over egged the idea here Bren. Agreed emotion does count for a lot in the modern game but really are we not more concered with the depth of the Irish squad. An emotional out-half will surely be bested but a higher quality player and I am sure you will agree that the second best - and some might argue on current form the best - out half is an Ozzy playing in Munster (Paul Warwick) all the emotion in the world will not change that fact
Hugh, Ireland
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Give them a chance.
Harry, Cork
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now that Irish rugby is in such ‘slump’. Does this mean all the ‘Ra Ra’ and wanna be rugby supporters give back the tickets to the genuine rugby fans? I hope this year it will be a lot easier to get a ticket than last time England played over here. I’ve never come across more bandwagoners than that at the English game. "Which way is Ireland playing?"
Paul Harte, Terenure
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Brendan Cole’s article is systematic of the media, being down beat about the National side. The Positives: Ireland only conceded 2 tries in the three match series. Our forwards and set pieces matched and better the opposition and the player panel has been increased. There was definite improvements from the coaches Kiss and Smal but questions will have to be asked about Gaffney output.
Richard Bartley, London
REPLY One of those matches was against Canada. Also, Argentina’s world ranking did not reflect itself in the calibre of the side that took the field at Croke Park.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Super article. loved it. Very very very good. All makes perfect sense. Hope we find our feet soon
Ian, Kerry
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Great article again, Brendan. Watching Wales on Saturday. At least for 60 minutes, I wanted them to be the Irish team! Passion. Pride. And well protected, explosive talent when the opportunity arises. This is what we want to see... not robots conditioned to beyond the point of meaning, unable to pass a ball to each other. There is a lot of silence when Ireland are playing rugby now, and not so long ago it wasn't like that at all. C’mon IRELAND!!!!
Marcus, Dublin
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Brendan. You seem to be jumping on board the pessimism train along with the rest of your colleagues in the press. Ireland have beaten, for the first time in two years a team ranked ahead of them and are all but guarantteed a 1/4 final spot in the next world cup, so cheer up. Re: the “unacceptable seating” you are way off the mark. I attend GAA games regularly and you and your other negative rugby friends are the first people I have ever heard complain. Poor support is the bigger problem here.
Mike from Cork, Dublin
REPLY We need to keep in mind that Argentina’s world ranking is not a reflection on their true position in world rugby, and that Ireland were actually strong favourites to win the game.
On Croke Park, the type of supporter present may be an issue, but the size of the pitch area is, to me, the biggest problem.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thanks for all your comments.
Brendan Cole
