Anti-social behaviour and the one-day strike

Monday, 23 Nov 2009

David Nally

Editor

The issue of anti-social behaviour is one that never goes away with communities reporting an ever-increasing problem of vandalism, low level violence and intimidation on their streets. A number of government taskforces have reported on it, with ASBOs becaming the latest brainwave to tackle it in recent years. But ASBOs have so far proved ineffective and communities continue to demand a greater Garda presence and greater Garda visibility as the answer to their problems.

But can there realistically be a Garda available every time trouble rears its head on a housing estate? Is the answer a more long-term attempt to tackle the causes of anti-social behaviour or is that giving in to the thugs themselves. That's what we'll be discussing on the programme tonight and as always we welcome your views and comments.

We'll also be focussing on tomorrow's one-day public sector strike. It could be the first of many and those with children off school or who have had long-awaited hospital appointments cancelled will be perhaps the most directly affected. We'll have unions, employers and affected groups in studio to debate whether the strike will achieve anything and whether the public sector unions are right to say they have given a lot and can't be expected to keep footing the bill for the recession.

Hope you get something from the show tonight.

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Comments:

Well done to the government and the bankers. You still have the public and private at each others throats, when the bankers should be hammered with all of these costs.

Posted by darre williams on November 23, 2009 at 10:54 PM GMT #

Like Santa's bearded, little helpers in Powerscourt yesterday, the Union leaders are living in Fantasy land. In the real world people are working 15 hour days to keep my businesses on the road and their staff in jobs. While I appreciate the lower paid should not bear a significant burden, we all bear a responsiblity to bring our economy and country back to normality. It is a myth that everyone in the private sector benefited hugely from the celtic tiger. We consistently focused on buliding a sustainable company, reinvesting our profits in our company, creating jobs and not in pensions, decisions which are critical to help us survive now, no fancy cars or perks. The largest benefit I and my brothers had was not having to work 16 hour days, 7 days a week and being able to work relatively normal hours. Our business has halved this year, essentially overnight, paycuts for everyone and now it's back to the grind stone...would someone in the public service be prepared to do this without overtime or take the personal risk to invest in a company and create jobs for others. They appall me and I'm sick of the pathetic arguments to defend luxurious pensions and modest pay cuts. What is fairness??

Posted by Rachel Dillon on November 23, 2009 at 10:55 PM GMT #

How come no one is bringing up the fact that most public sector office workers work a 33 3/4 hour week? Make them work a full week and maybe we won't touch their wages. Sure they get paid electronically and still get 30 minutes every Thursday to cash the cheque they no longer get!

Posted by Liam ó Táilliúir on November 23, 2009 at 11:00 PM GMT #

I'm a manager in the private sector. At the height of the boom, I earned €40k but my hours have been cut and I now earn €24k with no prospect of my hours been reinstated - a big drop when you have a mortgage etc.. I believe that the public sector are incorrect in going on strike. If I had gone on strike when my company cut my salary, I would probably not have a job by now!

Posted by Sinead on November 23, 2009 at 11:07 PM GMT #

The nurse who is paying 150 euro a week towers the penions levy must have been earning 2142.85 euro a week before deduction and now 1992.85 a week. The nurse well not go hungry. Note 150/7=21.43 21.43 x 100= 2143 2143-150= 1993euro

Posted by edward o sullivan on November 23, 2009 at 11:09 PM GMT #

pat, i have to question a comment you made about saliva and the possible transmission of hiv. That is not scientifically valid-you'd need to drink a bath of saliva to have a miniscule chance of infection . Please don't add to any more of the misinformation about aids.

Posted by colm byrne on November 23, 2009 at 11:13 PM GMT #

The antisocial brigade are the result of unwanted pregnancies and a pro-life promotion of single motherhood over abortion. Some people should be encouraged not to have children. Do you seriously think the drug pushers should be encouraged to have more kids?

Posted by Yuki on November 23, 2009 at 11:17 PM GMT #

The Pension Levy for public servants is a pay cut. The word pension is a media name. The act that brought in the so called "pension levy" does not mention the word pension. My wife is a part-time worker in the public service for 20 years & was not allowed to enter the pension scheme. She is now being charged the "pension levy" As for the so called guaranteed rolls royce pensions. My pension after 40 years service & pension contributions every week will not be much more than the state non-contributory pension. Everyone in effect has a guaranteed pension, even those who never paid into one or worked a day in their lives. The private sector should be asking why their pensions are so bad & taking action to protect them instead of cutting at the public sector. Everyone is entitled to a secure job with reasonable pay & a pension at the end of it. Ask the government, bankers etc why that's not happening. I believe that evryone who has lost a job, pension, home should be out marching on the streets & making their voice heard. Not just those in the public sector

Posted by Jim Quinn on November 23, 2009 at 11:34 PM GMT #

To put things in context and the investment in young people. On today’s news it was announced that one hundred and fifty million euro was spent on the new criminal court in Dublin. At the same time the youth service has had huge cutbacks in the youth service budget. What does that say about our society and the government’s future investment in our youth? Gary Crawford Youth worker Dublin.

Posted by Gary Crawford on November 23, 2009 at 11:37 PM GMT #

I think it is so horrible that you can put all the blame on teenagers in this. Teenagers would not be like that if it wasn't for there parents and there influence. Telling there kids not to curse while cursing themselves, drinking every weekend etc. Teenagers of these days will mostly grow into good people because they know what way not to teach there kids. I'm not putting all the blame on teenagers. But on the internet it is mostly older people that are perverted or the majority of builders etc. It's disgusting and teenagers being discriminated. Most of the people i know, from a young age were made out to be nothing, so why would they respect you or any adult who puts them all into one box. I'm not saying there are not bad ones, but, there are bad people in general. NOT just teenagers. Thank you.

Posted by Mary on November 23, 2009 at 11:42 PM GMT #

Good evening, I just want to voice my suggested solution to the anti social behaviour problem. All Garda members should serve 6 months minimum in the "Lugs Brannigan" training college(This would not take long to clean up our streets). Regards, -owen

Posted by Owen Brady on November 23, 2009 at 11:46 PM GMT #

After watching your show tonight I would like to clear up one point. The lady from ISME stated that public servants were paying the "pension levy" towards a pension that they were guaranteed. I am a retained firefighter within the public service and do not receive a pension along with many other public servants who pay this levy and get no pension. It's a pity she did not get her facts straight before speaking on your show.

Posted by Robbie Mahon on November 23, 2009 at 11:49 PM GMT #

I'm interested in finding out more about the website of the Shanakill community, are they in Kerry, for an insight into how they are handling anti-social behaviour. Needless to say it is everywhere and I am sure there are simple solutions to this one which we are overlooking. Your discussion was very good, more please.

Posted by Ann Hetherington on November 23, 2009 at 11:52 PM GMT #

Without taking from individual experiences of antisocial behaviour, it does strike me that every generation believes that the younger generation have no respect, are more violent etc etc. and this goes back a long long time. While yes our society has problems it is adults who have shaped it and therefore carry most of the blame for how young people react to it. what is our objective as a society, how do communicate responsibility, civic duty and accountability to our youth, not very well to my mind. When the panel tonight spoke of respect I feel they meant the type of respect for authourity that allowed thousands of children to be abused - physically, emotionally and sexually by adults - the good aul days - you can have them - I would prefer our current society to one ruled by the church and gardai

Posted by Brian Murphy on November 23, 2009 at 11:53 PM GMT #

Dear Pat, Firstly, I am totally shocked at the way the audience has painted all the young people with the same brush when all the young people are not the same!! I am currently on work placement and am an active volunteer in the Clare Youth Service and I have seen many young people doing unbelievable things which they do not get praise for by the other members of the public. It is known to everybody from every walk of life, we know that if one does not get praise, one will not continue or repeat the action(a.k.a "shit for thanks"). I grew up in a disadvantaged area of Ennis and I feel that the hole community guard thing is absolutely hilarious! Do people not realise that people see, people do; if a young person sees that there is lack of respect by the older members of society towards an authority figure, it will have a domino effect! Now I am not, under any circumstances, saying every older members of society is disrespectful towards an authority figure. In my own opinion, I believe the ASBO and GYDP projects should be scrapped and the punishment should be harder and followed through because the human being lives on a trail and error basis. I also believe that prisons should not be seen as a "luxury camp". It is an obvious fact that the country is totally and utterly lacking in facilities for the youth. The government needs to open up to young people, cut out the bull and actually tell us what our limitations are to creating projects for ourselves that we will take it in ourselves to make a positive thing out of it. Secondly Pat, I noticed that your audience was full of mature and older people but yet you were talking about the youth. I felt we were not allowed to speak for ourselves and re-enforce that we are not jars and do not deserve to be labelled. A great woman once said to me "Don't let one's behaviour seem challenging to you just because your not used to it, look at it as different and question yourself, how do you change to fit in with that behaviour." Society is changing and maybe the country as a whole need to think outside of the box. Maybe its time to include us, the young people of Ireland, into the blueprints of the future of the country! Listen to young people of Ireland and help us to help society change for the better!! Orla Moloney, Ennis.

Posted by Orla Moloney on November 24, 2009 at 12:03 AM GMT #

Anti social beaviour in all its manifestations can have a devestating effect on communities and its inhabitants. The causes of anti social behaviour are multi layered, and any attempt at tackling the root causes of same require the full co-operation of many agencies. It is somewhat understandable that people consider punitive measures as an option of first preference when dealing with anti social behaviour. However such sentiments should be tempered by the reality that incarcaration costs on average 100,000 euro per detainee. Furthermore, individuals who are typically imprisoned for low level crimes have extremely high rates of recidivism. It really is counterproductve to imprison an individual for low level crime (at a high cost to the state), considering the reality that this same individual will statistically reoffend within a short time period upon release. There is merit in community efforts that aim to educate and reform individuals involved in anti social behaviour. One such measure which was not mentioned on tonights show in any detail was the concept of restorative justice. This is an approach which is particularly well suited with dealing with low level and indeed in many countries serious crimes. It is an approach which aims to rehabilitate offenders by generating within them an awareness of the impact of their wrongdoing. It is not an approach which merely requires an offender to "say sorry", it also requires offenders to make amends in tangible ways to communities and victims. There are many programs which come within the remit of restorative justice, and while there is not the time to go into it here, i suggest it is something that communities all over our country would benefit from exploring. The National Commission on Restorative Justice is about to release a report in the immediate future on the topic.

Posted by Martin Haverty on November 24, 2009 at 12:10 AM GMT #

I think Pat Kenny's flippant comment about catching the HIV virus from saliva was an ignorant and uneducated commented to make (comment made when the female bus driver said she was spat on by a group of teenagers). There is such a stigma placed on HIV/AIDS that I feel Pat Kenny's comment will just add fuel to the fire. HIV is only present in saliva in minute amounts and is insufficient to cause infection with HIV.

Posted by Y on November 24, 2009 at 08:07 PM GMT #

Good program. The solution here is to take a variety of approaches: - As the example of Tralee showed, local residents can take back their areas if supported and led effectively. Paradoxically, I have found that the problem has to get really serious before anyone will do anything. In my own area, only a few houses are affected so most residents are loath to come to aid someone in distress from vandals from a combination of fear and apathy. - The justice systrem: ASBOs seem to be a waste of time. One mechanism that has been found to work in the US (Hawaii, for example) is to punish quickly rather than severely. Increasing sentence lengths will not work because it actually lengthens the amount of time that the system arrives at the sentencing - often a year or more. An immediate night in the cells for a first repeat offense, an immediate week for a second, plus curfews etc. for a young offender on probation are a far better deterrent than producing a mountain of paperwork and effort for a molehill of effect. - Local policing committee - more community involvement, rather than councillors.

Posted by Toby Joyce on November 26, 2009 at 03:39 PM GMT #

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